The Malaysian Insider

Allah is GOD of all, just like my GOD is GOD of all. GOD is GOD by whatever name. Don't be so shameless as to monopolise the name of Allah. Allah or GID cannot be very pleased,can HE?

Here's the fallacy of government's argument.

Would catholics mistake a Muslim Allah as theirs as well?

Umno wants to monopolise the word "Allah" for racial and political reasons. Without this exclusivity they will just be corrupt and racist umno. Religion is used make them more holy and righteous. They think Malaysian are shallow and stupid.

Firdaus asks why pick Allah? Yes precisely. Why did the muslims pick Allah? The word Allah has been used by Christians and Jews long before Islam came into existence. So why did they not use another name for their muslim God? You come later and you want to stop other people? Is this fair?

Muslims elsewhere don't argue over it..Firdaus is right..you'd better study your religion and history more because it is ignorance in Malaysia that makes the authorities stop the use of the name Allah. This is political and undemocratic and unfair, not to mention un-Islamic.

To Firdaus Rosli,

I do not believe that the Herald usage of Allah was intended to mislead the Muslims, as we know it is a newsletter for Christians not Muslims, mana ader orang Muslim baca. And please read previous usage of Allah in the newsletter whether Herald was used or intended to convert Musims into Christian. Your words are making a mockery of Malays and Muslims.

The lack of understanding both on the Christians and Muslims commentator show a dangerous disparity in Malaysia society.

@angryaboutanything
How do you translate the three elements of the christian trinity by using only one word: Tuhan? This is why Allah has been used to translate the Father part of the Trinity from the first Bahasa bible 4 centuries ago. Who's the Home minister to say which word can, which word cannot?

@firdaus rosli
Allah has been used by Arabs of all religions forever (muslim, christian and jews), used by christian Indonesians ever since christians landed there. Agreed with you, I do not think muslims are misled in the same way as christians are not misled by the term. Only limited people, such as apparently Malaysia's Home ministry officials, can be confused.

Can we now leave this non-issue to rest? The Herald is sold in a mere 12,000 copies, solely in churches and clearly labelled for non-muslims only, what else do we need?

Think out of the box - instead of banning the Hearld, why not ban muslims from reading the Hearld or ban the distribution of the Hearld to the Muslims.

Reading many of the comments from Muslims, there seems to be an underlining suspicion that the Church wants to use ALLAH with the intention to mislead muslims.

Is there any documentated case of a muslim reading the Hearld or other christian publication under the mistake that it was a Muslim publication because the word ALLAH was used?

Would a Muslim having chanced upon a copy of the Hearld and read it, become confused and think that the Hearld was a Muslim publication and thereby be mislead? Is there any such case?

It that are the reasons, then why not have big bold letters stated on the Hearld's front page, that this is a CHRISTIAN PUBLICATION NOT TO BE READ BY MUSLIMS.

Is the Hearld circulated to the public at large? No it is not, it is printed for private circulation amongst Catholics only and mainly distributed in Churches.

Why use Bahasa Melayu? There are Christians in East Malaysia who speak and read in Bahasa Melayu only and this is probably the reason why the Hearld includes a section in Bahasa Melayu as it does also in Tamil and Mandrin.

Why use "ALLAH" instead of GOD? On reason could be for the benefit of East Malaysians and other Malaysians proficient only in Bahasa Melayu, christian literature namely Bibles and books are obtained in Malay from Indonesia. Our East Malaysian christians have been using ALLAH in Churches for some time now and it did not happen recently.

Many may be surprised to learn that the use of Allah by Christians in many other countries is not prohibited or frowned upon. As such, in Christian literature from Indonesia in Bahasa Indonesia - ALLAH is used for God.

We must also note that many churches in Malaysia use different languages to preach. In KL, services are conducted every Sunday in English, Mandrin, Tamil, Tagalog, Vietnamese and yes even in Bahasa Melayu. Yes, Christians even sign chrisitan songs in Bahasa Melayu (100%). Language is not a factor.

We must note that the younger generation are no longer proficient in the English language and for example many younger and even some older Indian Malaysians cannot write or read Tamil (no offence meant, sadly I am one such example).

What language is the Church to use to teach and instruct this younger generation of Malaysians nutured in schools in Bahasa Melayu?

What language is the Church going to use in the next 10 years to communicate with its flock in Malaysia? What other words would be banned and Christians barred from using them?

the muslims are not stupid. many of my friends who are muslims are bursting to go forward with their dreams through islam but cannot do so as the authorities may be stifling their growth. some grow quietly.

To @Eric

The question should be, should Christians in China wish to use Allah as their God's name would it be barred by the Chinese Government? This answer certainly would be NO.

Also, if the Christians wanted to use the Mandrin word for GOD, would this be an issue in China? Would the Chinese non christians become confused? God is the Tamil language is used by Christians and yet the Hindus are not confused or have protested. Why?

Question - who is going to bear the cost of translating all the Christian Literature into Bahasa Melayu wherein Tuhan is used instead of God. This could be one of the factors why it is more economical to import Christian works in Bahasa Indonesia for use amongst Christians in Malaysia.

It is rightly said here that the Herald is meant for Christians and any others who read it is their own choice. Type the word "SEX" in the goggle search engine, choose "IMAGES" and you will get lots of SEX IMAGES. Why you type the word in the first place, are you being forced to type it or is it your own personal choice? So why you read The Herald when it is intended for Christians only? Good or Bad is your personal choice, so stop complaining and blaming others for your own failures and lack of religious maturity and understanding. The guy who covered himself bombs and blow up innocent peoples including himself thinks he is doing right, that is his choice, so what can others say? Nothing.

We would all live happily in peace if we all choose what we want for ourselves and our children and stop telling others it is right or wrong. It is said "take the dirt from your own eye first"

May Allah my Almighty God Enlighten You All and Bring Peace. (Am i wrong to say this?
.. your choice)

A good word for ALLAH in Bahasa Melayu is TUHAN or ILLAHI.

I think the KDN should allow the publication of the Christian Herald to publish their Bahasa Malaysia section using whatever name for God that they want to use until the Courts decides on the matter. I see this case is going all the way to the Federal Court as the Herald's publisher does not want to let go of the issue that they have created.

KDN need not give too much publicity to a publication which is small in number and limited to Catholics in Malaysia.

I believe Muslims in Malaysia would not be easily converted just because the Christian Herald uses the word ALLAH for GOD in its Bahasa Melayu section, if there are such fears.

the government should keep its grimy and graspy hands off religion. if it wants to use issues to champion its cause in the name of whatever race, then just leave religion alone.
religion is pure and clean, but politics under any name and for whatever race is dung.
let the professionals in the matter undertake a study to the middle east because that is the cradle of the religions that are disputing the name of their gods.
from there, it can be determined the communities and religions that have been using which name for their gods since time immemorial.
it is just senseless and chicken brained to argue and slug it out over a word that is strictly between the believer and his god.
wise up, malaysians!

we Malaysian are more sensible, educated and can differentiate between the teaching of various religion. The use of one word is highliy unlikely to mislead and influence our beliefs. Surely we deserve more credit than that.

These fat cats must have nothing better to do than to so prescrptive as what woard can be use. I wonder what ruling will they think of next, the length of our hair????

why pick Allah?
written by firdaus rosli, January 08, 2009
all religions have different names for their worshiped God. this is a clear attempt to mislead the muslims. so for muslims, please have a better knowledge about Islam to avoid being misled by those people under the name of "freedom of religion". if we are been misled, it is our fault at the first place,that we don't have enough Islamic knowledge.
+0


...
written by angryaboutanything, January 08, 2009
There is another world for GOD, and that is Tuhan. If the Muslims find it uncomfortable for Christian using the Arabic definition of God in another religion, that sounds sensible to me.

If Herad truly wants the best for the Bumiputra Christian, please reconsider the use of Allah. Like what been said God is the same whichever way being named. Tuhan should works just fine.


The word "Allah" is an Arabic word not Malay. The word has been used by Arab Christians long before Islam came into existence. It is still used being used in the Arab countries with no objection from the Muslim Arabs. Why are the Muslims here objecting so vehemently?

Malaysia don't own the word and thus cannot monopolize it or politicize it.

Thinkoutofthebox pretty much answered for me already. But let me try to enlighten you as requested.
Why I talk about 4 centuries ago is because it is the time the first Bahasa bibles were translated. Even today Bahasa bibles are pretty much the same. You may not believe but there were christians in Malaysia and Indonesia from that time and certainly even earlier. I am not comparing today with then.
No one says Allah is irreplaceable. I actually believe it is interesting you want to rewrite all Bahasa bibles because you find christian theologians got it wrong from the first bible translation. My advice is to send a letter to the bible publishing bodies in Malaysia and Indonesia to tell them that your translations are better and in what capacity you want them to change.
Which is exactly the point, what is the Home ministry's business telling people what word to use? With this kind of argument, the jews can come up and tell muslims and christians to back off using Allah since they were the first to use it! Or the christians can come up and says that since christianity is still the largest religion in the world, others have no business using it.
I am missing your point on your China question. But remember same story in Indonesia.
I have to agree with eddydaud (except for the first sentence), for once! Neither muslims or christians are likely to be swayed by the use of Allah in both religions. Like I said this is a non-issue as it is a 12,000 copy magazine sold in churches! The real issue is the Home ministry should focus on its core task of battling crime, not issuing petty rulings. I hope this helps.

PS: Arabs speak Arabic and not Arabian.

"would confuse followers of Islam in Malaysia."
Why are Muslims always confused as claimed by the government.

Firdaus, yes! please tell your people to have better knowledge on ur own religion to avoid misled by ur own people. Read the history.

My point is do Christians in China uses the word Allah or insist of using such word? Their translation is localize to their own language, so should we. I have no problem with Christian Arabs using "Allah" because it is their native language. Ours is Bahasa.

The real problem learned from this incident is always the same. When will the Government and Malaysian willing to come out and discuss this religious matter in public before banning this and that.

Do the Gov not know that many Christians grew up all their life believing in "Allah"; and now they need to change the way they call their God? When will the Gov act on the best for all. When will Msian learns to understands those who are different from themselves.

Allah (Arabic: الله‎, Allāh, IPA: [ʔalˤːɑːh] pronunciation (help·info)) is the standard Arabic word for 'God. While the term is best known in the West for its use by Muslims as a reference to God, it is used by Arabic-speakers of all Abrahamic faiths, including Christians and Jews, in reference to "God". The term was also used by pagan Meccans as a reference to the creator-god, possibly the supreme deity in pre-Islamic Arabia.
The term Allāh is derived from a contraction of the Arabic definite article al- "the" and ʾilāh "deity, god" to al-lāh meaning "the [sole] deity, God" (ho theos monos). Cognates of the name "Allāh" exist in other Semitic languages, including Hebrew and Aramaic. The corresponding Aramaic form is אֱלָהָא ˀĔlāhā in Biblical Aramaic and ܐܰܠܳܗܳܐ ˀAlâhâ or ˀĀlōho in Syriac.

The contraction of al- and ʾilāh in forming the term Allāh ("the god", masculine form) parallels the contraction of al- and ʾilāha in forming the term Allāt ("the goddess", feminine form).

Pre-Islamic Arabia
In pre-Islamic Arabia, Allah was used by Meccans as a reference to the creator-god, possibly the supreme deity.Allah was not the sole divinity and the notion of the term may have been vague in the Meccan religion.Allah had associates and companions, whom pre-Islamic Arabs considered as subordinate deities. Meccans held that a kind of kinship existed between Allah and the jinn.Allah had sons and the local deities of al-‘Uzzá, Manāt and al-Lāt were his daughters. The Meccans possibly associated angels with Allah.
Muslims:
In Islam, Allah is the proper name of God and humble submission to His Will, Divine Ordinances and Commandments is the pivot of the Muslim faith."He is the only God, creator of the universe, and the judge of humankind." "He is unique (wahid) and inherently one (ahad), all-merciful and omnipotent."The Qur'an insists upon "the reality of Allah, His inaccessible mystery, His various names, and His actions on behalf of His creatures."
According to the tradition of Islam there are 99 Names of God (al-asma al-husna lit. meaning: "The best names") each of which evoke a distinct characteristic of Allah. All these names refer to Allah, the supreme and all-comprehensive divine name.Among the 99 names of God, the most famous and most frequent of these names are "the Merciful" (al-rahman) and "the Compassionate" (al-rahim).
Most Muslims use the untranslated Arabic phrase "insha' Allah" (meaning "God willing") after references to future events.Muslim discursive piety encourages beginning things with the invocation of "bismillah"(meaning "In the name of God").
Muslims are recommended to repeat phrases like "Subhan-Allah" (Holiness be to God), "Alhamdulillah" (Praise be to God), "La-il-la-ha-illa-Allah" (There is no deity but God) and "Allāhu Akbar" (God is great) as a devotional exercise of remembering God (zikr).In a Sufi practice known as zikr Allah (lit. remembrance of God), the Sufi repeats and contemplates on the name Allah or other divine names while controlling his or her breath

Others:
Arabic-speakers of all Abrahamic faiths, including Christians and Jews, use the word "Allah" to mean "God".The Christian Arabs of today have no other word for 'God' than 'Allah'.Arab Christians for example use terms Allāh al-ab (الله الأب) meaning God the father, Allāh al-ibn (الله الابن) mean God the son, and Allāh al-rūḥ al qudus (الله الروح القدس) meaning God the Holy Spirit (See God in Christianity for the Christian concept of God).
Arab Christians have used two forms of invocations that were affixed to the beginning of their written works. They adopted the Muslim basm-allah, and also created their own Trinitized basm-allah as early as the eight century CE. The Muslim basm-allah reads: "In the name of God, the Compassionate, the Merciful." The Trinitized basm-allah reads: "In the name of Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, One God." The Syriac, Latin and Greek invocations do not have the words "One God" at the end. This addition was made to emphasize the monotheistic aspect of Trinitian belief and also to make it more palatable to Muslims.
According to Marshall Hodgson, it seems that in the pre-Islamic times, some Arab Christians made pilgrimage to the Kaaba, a pagan temple at that time, honoring Allah there as God the Creator.


I still prefer the terms, "Tuhan Bapa", "Tuhan Anak" and "Roh Kudus".

Many of you who argue that Christians should use an alternative to "Allah" miss the point entirely. It's not that there's no better word to use. It's because of the religious discrimination that is implied with the ban.

Case in point: If the White House banned Muslims from printing "Allah" from the Quran for fear that it might encourage suicide bombing (what with extremists yelling "Allahu Akhbar" before blowing themselves up), should all Muslims quite accept the ruling and re-translate a million or so Qurans? Of course not! Everyone, Muslim or not, would be up in arms! "Religious/Racial discrimination!" they would cry.

It's insulting to suggest that Christians would resort to trickery to get converts. And Christians are not held at gunpoint to remain Christians. Muslim conspiracy theorists would probably be just as insulted if Muslims were ever accused of tricking others into the faith.

I believe that Muslims, Christians and Jews share the same God. They all come from the same line. So why quibble over the name? Just love one another and love God and everything will be alright.

I could not agree more with your latest comment about the Gov acting unilaterally without checking the facts first.
Thank you!

Tell me, 400 years ago, were all Malays Muslims? For 400 years did the Malays object to the word allah being used by the Christians? Islam and Christianity came to Malaysia around the same century. So what's the big deal ? For nearly 600 years they co-existed without any trouble, so now, who are the trouble causers who want to dictate their authority on another religion?

In the end .. "bagi ku agama ku bagi mu agama mu!" and lets just live in peace .. susah sangat ka?

As some commentators have pointed out, no religious community can claim monopoly on the outright use of the disputed word. It is Arab in origin and by custom Arab Christians have traditionally used the word to refer to God. The Arabs in the region never questioned right of the Christians to use the word. An Indian Christian no matter what ethnicity he belongs to could freely refer to the God he worships, as Bhagwan, Ishwar/ Eshwar or Parameshwar without creating any offense to Hindu religious sensitivity. On the other hand the Paramount Ruler carries the title Parameswara. Why, Until recently a motor car made in Malaysia had been named Iswara. No Hindu high priest or theologian was ever heard to have protested to its use.

If they want to print their publication in Bahasa Malaysia, then use "Tuhan" not "Allah". Allah is Arabic. We muslim use Allah to refer to our GOD is due to our Islamic teachings are more in Arabic.

If they are asking to use Bahasa Malaysia in their publication, then use Tuhan not Allah. Allah is not Bahasa Malaysia.

Therefore why the big fuss over using Bahasa Malaysia. If they want to use Bahasa Malaysia, then the correct translation is Tuhan.

If they want to use Allah, then they have to print their publication in Arabic not Bahasa Malaysia.

GOD in Bahasa Malaysia is TUHAN not ALLAH. ALLAH is in Arabic that means GOD.

Jangan politik kan agama !. be sensible and don't make things small into a big and sensitive issue.

Salam,

If the Herald want to use Allah in their bible so be it. Dewan Bahasa & Pustaka aka DBP should give their hands to help the Herald/Christians claim their rights to use Bahasa Melayu in their holy books.

And, ppl please don't confuse between government ministry/government decision and Muslims. I as a Malay Muslim honestly don't have any problem if the Herald using the word of Allah or BM in their books.

I fully support Rev Father Lawrence Andrew to sue the government because of the unfair treatment by the ministry officials.

p.s. I don't think PAS would handle it any better than BN/UMNO. Instead, if PAS is the government, they would surely do it more strictly about this issue!

Thank you Mukmin, just wanted to hear that.

This problem only arises when humans attempt to define God.
What a strange thing that creation interpret Creator.
God gave himself a name besides other titles to show his roles.
Why not use back the original names and titles exactly as he told us instead of replaced title references in accordance to humans' "wisdom"?
How will people exercise love according to his command if they start fighting over the way they define their 'God(s)'?
What strange logic?

"Tuhan Bapa", "Tuhan Anak" and "Roh Kudus"

Ha..Ni da ada orang tolong terjemahkan dalam Bahasa Melayu. Dah tak payah nak mengada-ngada lagi dah. Dah tak ada alasan lagi nak guna Allah.

Kalau guna juga, sah la tu ada udang di sebalik batu.

Saudara Muslim sekalian yang tidak kisah dengan penggunaan Allah dalam akhbar kristian, sila rujuk pendapat saudara apocryphalist ini.

'Saya telah menghuraikan dengan agak halus juga mengenai isu ini dalam rencana http://deminegara.blogspot.com...ng-of.html
Bertarikh 12 Oktober, 8.21 AM. Sila baca jika anda mahu perincian mendalam.
Secara ringkasnya, hujjah saya berbentuk demikian:-

1. Di dalam Kitab Injil Perjanjian Baru tidak pernah sekali pun entiti Tuhan itu diberikan nama. Maka kenapa pula dalam Injil Bahasa Malaysia tiba-tiba entiti ini mahu dinamakan sebagai Allah? Mana-mana pembaca kristian dalam blog ini yang berkata Tuhan dalam Injil itu mempunyai nama, sila berikan hujjah anda, muka surat di mana, versi injil yang mana dan seterusnya.
2. Malahan kenapa tidak diterjemahkan secara terus sahaja Lord, God atau Father dalam Perjanjian Baru kepada perkataan Tuhan atau Bapa?
3. Jika sekalipun entiti “Tuhan” atau “Bapa” ini mahu dibubuh nama, maka kenapa tidak diberi saja nama yang telah sememangnya berada dalam Perjanjian Lama, yaitu “Yahweh”? Padahal Kitab Perjanjian Lama itu telah dicantumkan dari awal lagi dengan Perjanjian Baru dan dibawa kemana-mana?
4. Jangan sekali2 menganggap kemasukkan nama Allah ini tidak bertujuan untuk mengkristiankan orang-orang melayu, kerana memang itu tujuannya secara terperinci dan tidak ada tujuan lain. Malahan secara beginilah ratusan ribu anak-anak melayu di Indonesia terpedaya dan menukar agama.
5. Lain pula halnya dengan penggunaan “Allah” dalam injil berbahasa arab. Kalau ada pun, ianya adalah menyalahi Vatican itu sendiri kerana seperti saya katakan tadi, tidak terdapat pemanggilan entiti Tuhan ini melalui nama hatta dalam bahasa Yunani seklai pun. “Lord” atau “God” kalau diterjemahkan dalam bahasa arab, ianya adalah “Rabb” dan kalau “Bapa” pula, ianya adalah “Aba”. Jadi “Allah” itu diterjemahkan dari perkataan apa, kalau mahu sangat diterjemahkan?
6. Selain dari isu linguistik yang tidak tepat, penterjemahan “God” kepada “Allah” juga adalah menyalahi aqidah. Sila baca penulisan saya yang awal di atas untuk huraian lebih terperinci.
7. Contoh penyerapan halus untuk anak-anak melayu: Dalam satu ayat seperti “The Lord has said …” akan diterjemahkan kepada “Allah telah berkata …”. Kalau ini boleh diterima maka justru boleh diterima juga ayat yang berbunyi “My Father and me are One” yaitu “Allah dan aku adalah zat yang sama”. Banyak lagi contoh yang saya boleh beri tapi naskhah injil saya tiada dihadapan saya sekarang ini. Cukup dinyatakan bahawa penggunaan Allah bertujuan untuk menusuk minda melayu secara halus.
8. Adakah anda pikir bahawa setelah diterjemahkan ke dalam Bahasa Malaysia maka seluruh penganut kristian dalam negara ini yang rata-rata terdiri dari bangsa kaukas, cina, india dan serani, secara tiba-tiba naik semangat patriotik dan mula membaca injil mereka dalam bahasa melayu, bertutur dan menulis dalam bahasa melayu, berjual-beli dalam bahasa melayu? Tidak. Percayalah. Mereka akan masih menggunakan dan mengagungkan bahasa Inggeris hatta dalam gereja sekalipun. Injil melayu? Hanya untuk orang-orang melayu! Terutama sekali yang belum dikristiankan.
9. Kepada mereka-mereka yang berpikiran, “apa nak ditakutkan dipesongkan akidah. Iman kita tak kuat ker? Bukan kah undang-undang ada?”, jangan bangga dengan iman anda yang tipis tetapi disyaki kuat. Cukupkah ilmu anda dalam agama Islam itu sendiri, dan kemudian cukupkah ilmu anda dalam hal-hal agama lain yang berhubungkait dengan Islam? Kalu sudah cukup, sila hantarkan anak-anak anda ke Gereja dan berhujjah di sana. Saya sendiri pernah 5 kali ke gereja yang berbeza tetapi bukan sebagai pendengar tetapi sebagai pensyarah di atas pulpit mereka, mengenai agama Islam. Mujurnya ini semua berlaku sebelum 911 dan bigotri dan stereotyping masih lagi kecil dan perkara-perkara begini adalah munasabah.

Yang sangat saya khuatiri adalah pembikin polisi dalam kerajaan yang kurang berilmu dan pengalaman, alah dengan hujjah palsu penggunaan Allah dalam Injil dan menghalalkan polisi yang merugikan ini.'

Apocryphalist

I think it is the government fault not to emphasize islamic studies to our muslim children right from their early age in the education main stream. Now the government particularly the muslim political leaders fear that muslims will convert to other religions because of the word ALLAH. If every muslim is a 100% muslim fear not the usage of the word ALLAH by any religion. I doubt myself if our muslim leaders is 100% muslim with all the hanky panky going on in the government today. Wallah ualam.

I think this kind of problem happens only in Malaysia. The government seems to think that the Muslims in Malaysia are not that smart, therefore they can be misled by others easily. How wrong can they be?
Malaysians do have good brains, they can decide which faith/religion is right for them.