The Malaysian Insider

Talk to the press photographer and the pathalogist and you will know the difference of the gun shot wound with the gun that the police carry most of the time. I don't or will never believe our police are all such a sharp shooter. Did these so called criminals that died in the police shoot out died with a single shot or multiple shot? These question has never been answered, why? Because the truth is too obvious!

I dont think it is a racial issue. More towards the incompetance of the police than anything else. They shot a Malay teen running amok yesterday as well.

The police first task is to take control of the situation and calm things down and if that fails, and no other options available, only then they should use their weapons, and even then it should be to disable the suspect and not kill them.

There are body parts you can shoot to take down a suspect without killing them. Only the last resort when things are looking too dangerous for the public and themselves should they take action to shoot to kill.

The police need more training, why dont they get some outsiders with experience to train these morons rather than getting classy new cars for them and wasting taxpayers money!

Our policemen are just like cow-bows now, useless and weak in crime scene investigation e.g. Teoh Beng Hock'case, but 'excited' in shooting!!

If they are criminals, regardless of race, thd PDRM has every right to shoot them. Why pinpoint to the Indian commmunity? PDRM also shoot Indons, I don't hear Indonesian government complaining.

I am a DAP supporter but this time I cannot agree with you as those people who are killed by the police have guns and other weapons which they have used in their robberies and some of them have been very brutal to their victims. I don't see you commenting or outrage at these brutal robbers and commenting on the victims. If you or your love ones were to be bashed up or rape by these criminals ,I wonder whether you will be saying the same thing. What rubbish remarks you are making.

yeah, the malaysian police diraja has right to shoot without fear or favour those ALLEGED and SUSPECTED (repeat: ALLEGED and SUSPECTED) to be criminals. the stereotype script will go as usual : "police have to open fire because they were fired at first." maybe someone has to check and go around to find the bullets used by the suspect/s to fire the cops in every tragic incidents...synically, almost all the bullets fired at the cops would not hit either the policemen or their patrol cars. Alas!

DAP is start to talk bullshit. Revealing the police identity, is he trying to encourage the Indian to take revenge on the police? These are criminals. They are better in dead than alive. DAP is now so screw up that they are willing to take this issue for their political advantage by demonizing the police.

Sorry, I didn't agree with u on this. As long as these suspect has gun, regardless they are chinese, indian or malay...... they had just sign a death warrant.
Ask those who has been their victim.

dude, i respect your views but when talking, do base them on facts! Stop simply bashing the police, and imagine if you're man enough to handle a gun and uphold the law. It's a given fact that there are more criminals than cops...they're doing their jobs. You do yours. Just make sure its righteous.

pls lah, nothing to do the race. I really feel tired with politician-all issue just look from political and race

Crimes in this country is at critical stage. When you venture out, you are not safe until you get home. And even home too is not safe anymore. We need drastic action by police and if encounter style killing is the answer to instill fear among the would be criminals, then let these thugsters die. We need a safe malaysia and dont politicise everytime a criminal from your commnunity dies!

Gangsters-in-uniform murder gangsters-without-uniform. Case closed.

Anyone to stand up for the coppers if they are being shot first (as reported)by the robbers/suspected robbers and ultimately die?? NO cos coppers life is WORTHLESS compared to the robbers/suspected robbers. And how to attempt to arrest them while being shot at by the robbers/suspected robbers? Answer: Shout ' ini polis, lepaskan senjata dan letak dua belah tangan diatas kepala'. Bet the cop/cops will be shot dead before he even finish uttering the sentence.

"Why is it that the police seem to enjoy killing these suspected Indian criminals"
WHOA!! this is very coloured..

incidents like this is getting very politic and coloured. to keep cool, wonder what happened to the suggestion of using the TASER GUN? what about rubber bullets? then there'll be no more politicising of incidents like this.

" As long as these suspect has gun, regardless they are chinese, indian or malay...... they had just sign a death warrant. "

WRONG. No logic. But if they were not threatening anyone and maybe kept the weapons for self defense? A warning and confiscation would be more appropriate, no one has the right to take away a man's life for just owning a firearm. No reasonable judge would find that fair at all. A knife could also kill a person, but if not used to kill would that mean all people owning knives would be sentenced to death? So make sticks and stones illegal as well why don't you. Even without knives, if someone wanted to kill another hard enough, a killing would occur even with bare hands. Wheres the logic in taking away a life for owning a weapon that may never be used?

To rsbn001,2nd class & year of snake: Think, 5 people in a car and all get killed, and when there was only one gun found, and no police was injured or their vehicle damaged?????? Neither is there any detail of the shoot out given by the police except to show the assortments of weapons alleged to be in their possession.

Of course it leads to people assuming that it was shoot to kill rather than to apprehend. The police explanation is so illogical. This is what we are arguing about.

We demand that independent postmortem be done after every killing and the results revealed to the people than it will absolve the police of high handedness.

I wonder if he knows whats he talking about, probably his political bosses using him to politicise police issues. For someone who has been a victim of this kind of criminals I am glad they have been put away. If they are armed they will use it indiscrimately even if unprovoked. If the police stops you and you try to shoot and escape what do think the police will do ? Good riddance

This is not about race or colour ...this is about bad people doing bad things to others without a second thought in killing your love ones. Stop treating criminals as matyrs...I am so sick of people politicising every little thing to their advantage...be fair to the police...give credit when it is due.

When crimes are rampant, the cops are to be blamed. When criminals are shot dead, the cops are also to be blamed. Come on, let's be fair to them. There is no racial issue at all! The cops also recently shot a Malay who ran amok endangering the public. The rising crime rate in this country has to stop!
Try picture yourself in a situation where split-second decision has to be taken. Any split-second delay can cause your demise. Never let the enemy gain the upper hand!

If the death happend while in the lock out, I will blame the police. If the killings happened on the street, especially if the suspects have weapon, I won't blame the police.

There are so many innocent victims being injured or killed on the street by these brutal criminals, sometimes over a small amount of money or a cheap handphones. There should not be any mercy being given to them, especially if they have weapons, whether knife or guns.

Yeah, I am PR supporter, but definitely don't support this man's speech.

It is wrong to based this argument on racial basis. Does that means that the police kill the criminals if they are not Indians ?

I personally don't think this shooting incident is racist. i have lived in malaysia for over 30years, all the time in a copper and robber shooting incident normally the press would said those copper asked the robber for ID, and was shot at, so they decided to return a favour and all their(coppers') shot hit the robber, case close. What happened at the time of incident is all covered. I believe Malaysian police are not all sharp shooter, only special force have the privilege for shooting excersis. But one thing for sure is once you have a gun, you should be shot...even though i think not all 5 members of those killed criminals have guns.

mikecheong,

Probably why may be a good idea to train the cop to shout 'Freeze' instead or perhaps english as they are shorter. Coppers may be shot or injured but they have to remember it is part of the risk and they have to be prepared for it. No way, just cause you are cop, you are given license to kill.

Probably gonna be one of the few times I'll leap in defense of the police, 'cause I think DAP's blowing this out of proportion.

If the cops are being fired at, they have every right to shoot back at the shooter(s). If they have unarmed accomplices, that's really their problem. It's a risk they took when they decided to accompany an armed man.

Capital punishment for having a gun illegally by criminals already forced the cops to believe that the criminal will fire at them. If the criminals are fancifull foolish not to use or fire at cops and hoping that the cops in return will also not fire at them, then they should not blame the cops. Foolishness does not pay for either sides when live is a stake. Our laws have carved out such cowboy stlye executions by either sides who acted first.

Dont encourage this thugs. They deserve to be killed. The life of innocent people is at stake when you allow this idiots to move freely and do what they want. The police made the right choice. I sincerely appreciate and support police action on this criminals. DAP, you should be supporting the Police for their action not encouraging the criminals. We voted for you to provide safety support to the rakyat, not to protect the criminals. If you continue to support the criminals, you can count me off for support in next GE.

I don't support this politician's statement but I'm not blaming DAP either. It is his own views not the party's views. Saying BN is waging a war of revenge against the Indian community by using the police is being very emotional. Although I don't support BN I don't think they deserve this mudslinging either.

I am always surprised by these shootouts. No policeman is injured and all the suspects are killed.

To all those who lauded this shootout pls remember this can happen to anyone - the police don't have to prove anything. Their claim that a shot was fired by the suspects is enough. Are postmortems ever done

The police are hired to bring criminals to justice. Although they have a right to defend themselves, they are also duty bound not to be executioners.

I'll rather let these criminal dead before they can cause more harmful to my families and other malaysian! If you did nothing wrong, why you ran from police plus having weapons? It's not about backing PDRM but the criminals has gone too far lately!!! Don't feel safe even at own house with high securities!!! Don't committed to any wrongdoings and god will always bless you!

Dear PDRM, all the best and let's continue to reduce our crime rate ASAP! Don't just listen to all these politicians that just want to win some votes!!!

This is indeed going too far. It's one thing for a suspect to be found dead in custody of the police with suspicious marks on the body.

Being killed in a shootout with the police, on the other hand, is a different story, particularly if it can be proven that the other side had a gun, shot first and returned fire.

If it can be proven that police planted the gun and return shots were never fired, that’s a whole different story as well.

But to drag in the racial card here is a little ridiculous.

Harvin Dhillon says:

“There are body parts you can shoot to take down a suspect without killing them. Only the last resort when things are looking too dangerous for the public and themselves should they take action to shoot to kill.”

Seeing this really annoys me. Contrary to popular belief, NO, THERE AREN’T. Stop believing what you see on CSI and cop shows and STOP SPREADING THIS BIT OF MISINFORMATION.

Unlike all those action movies where police can magically shoot someone in the kneecap or shoulder, or shoot the gun out of someone’s hand, it's impractical to do that in real life. The chance of hitting someone firing away is low enough as it is without aiming for a particular body part.

Aiming for a moving limb that is smaller than the torso? A very high chance of missing. And a much higher chance that the bullet ricochets and hits an innocent bystander.

Also, even if you hit a shoulder or a limb the person shot can still rapidly bleed to death if it hits a major artery. So aiming for the torso is still the most logical choice, really.

I even read a silly comment on MI where someone argued that since only 1 gun was found the car police shouldn’t have shot all 5 of them. I wonder how the police could have known there was only 1 gun before the fight was over? If you are being fired at and you see 5 people it’s not unreasonable to assume all 5 are armed.

I doubt most of the people commenting here have ever held or fired a gun in real life, but in a real fire fight, it’s very difficult to see what’s going on. Don’t believe me, try going for a (ok let’s play it safe for civilians) paintball battle in a non-speedball scenario. After a quick shootout in a rubber estate a lot of the armchair theorists will suddenly come to appreciate how bloody hard it is to even find the shooter when they are shooting away at you, much less aim and hit the shooter without getting hit. If you STILL want to be Steven Seagal or whatever and AIM for an arm or leg… good luck, and nice knowing you, man.

In short: if you carry a gun, be responsible with your usage of it or be prepared to face lethal force. There are no warning shots. You gave away that right when you chose to carry a lethal weapon yourself.

If you still want to complain about police shooting to kill and want them to do it non-lethally, go campaign for our police force to be equipped with ranged taser guns instead. That at least is constructive.

Granted, there are a lot of bad apples in our corrupted police force. I too have had my bad experiences with our police. But there are also policemen who are at least trying to do something to keep the crime rate down and I am not letting my bad experiences with a few cause me to blindly join in on the bashing to vent my frustrations of the bad ones.

I’m glad most Malaysians are circumspect enough to be able to tell the difference. I’m just sad to find out that this DAP MP isn’t one of them.

Would the Police shoot to kill those thugs like mat rempits exp. ramp down a policeman during road block?

Hello LESLIEFONG, if mat rempits carry gun and shoot at the police, I am sure they will be shot too....

terkenang masa dulu duduk di berek polis. aman saja. polis tak ada tugas main bliard di kelab. Sebut nama polis orang dah kecut perut tapi kini orang dah tak respek dengan polis. kenapa agaknya? Teringat ketika kena saman tak pakai topi keledar. 10 kali polis sebut "saya saman!". Saya tak faham-faham .... akhirnya dia tulis juga atas kertas saya bayar saman di bahagian trafik. Kata kawan, kau ni pun satu. Bila polis sebut banyak kali dia nak saman, dia sebenarnya offer nak selesai cara lain. Kelepet kecil-kecil kertas? lepaslah. Begitu kisahnya.

They may be criminals and thugs regardless, the police's job is to arrest, control crime and bring them in, not trigger happy shoot to kill!

Get the guns off the POLICE first.
let them use sting guns instead.
They are trigger happy and want to test their shooting skills on humans.
They have no right !
They are GOVT. employees and must be punished severely in this case.

From the Straits Times (Singapore One)

Excuse me? An exchange of 12 shots? Suspects shot first? High speed chase down the Jelutong expressway?

Nothing trigger happy about the police there. Police from any other country would have done the same.

Honestly, where do these people get their definitions of a policeman's job? It's all very well to say vague phrases like "arrest, control crime and bring them in" but have you ever even given thought to the specifics on HOW to do that?

Nope. Didn't think so.




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GEORGE TOWN, MALAYSIA - Police gunned down a leader of the infamous Deva Gang after a high-speed chase through the busy Jelutong Expressway here, yesterday.

The man had opened fire at them when they intercepted him. The 37-year-old suspect, described as dangerous and high on the police wanted list, was found slumped on the front passenger seat of a Perodua Myvi, believed stolen in Johor.

State police chief Datuk Ayub Yaakob said there was an exchange of about 12 shots between the policemen and suspect when the chase ended abruptly in Pengkalan Weld at 3.50pm.


"The team had tailed him from Bukit Jambul after a tip-off, but the suspect sensed he was being followed while driving on the Jelutong Expressway.

"As they reached Pengkalan Weld, the suspect suddenly opened fire at the police, forcing them to intercept his car and shoot back."

He added that police recovered a pistol with a bullet inside the chamber and five bullets inside another magazine from the car.

Some paraphernalia for consuming syabu and a police baseball cap were also found.

Police also retrieved a forged Singapore identity card from the dead man.

"Our investigations show that he was planning to kidnap someone here," Ayub said, adding that the suspect was trigger-happy, dangerous and owned at least three pistols.

Police were now looking for other firearms and also the suspect's remaining gang members.

"We believe his death has weakened the Deva Gang," Ayub said.

Yesterday's success in nailing the suspect was a joint-effort between the Bukit Aman police team and the state police, he said.

The body has been sent to Penang Hospital for a post-mortem.
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Cheaper to kill the crooks than waste tax money feeding them in jail. BN needs tax $$$ for "better" things. Best to have all cops armed with MP7 with silencer - we don't want them waking up the neighborhood. With 40 rounds per clip I bet they will do a better job. Malaysia Boleh!!!

2nd class, do not be deceived. That guy is not a DAP supporter. just beware

You guys out there. Next time if you have to die, take along a few cops with you

"I'm supprised that no police shot dead!" one of the guy above said,... damn you really have issues here. So you want the police dead?! And protect the cirminals?!! When 3 cops died in ambush three years ago, where all this stupid M*** F***?!! I don't see any of DAP or stupid fellow above?!! !Oh.. maybe because the police is a MALAY?!! Is that the issue?!! You deserve to be shot at!!

Why don't DAP setup an awareness program to the would be robbers to not bring gun or shot at the police when doing their crime, maybe a tagline "Berhati-hati ketika merompak, ingatlah orang yang tersayang" would be nice.

I think Malaysian Police should quickly come out with a SOP (Standard Operating Procedure) which will make YABs Sugumaran happy.

1. The police must ascertain first whether the armed criminals are Indians or other races or nationalities.
2. If the armed criminals are non-Indians, eg Malays, Indonesians, Chinese, Sikhs, etc shoot them. They deserved to die because they do not surrender and lay down their arms. They are danger to the peace loving Malaysians and potential murderers of helpless civilians.
3. If the armed criminals are Indians, the police must get an Indian interpreter with a loud hailer to politely ask them in Tamil whether they are in fact criminals. If they are, they can always negotiate with the police for the best possible terms of surrender.
4. If the police need to chase a group of armed Indian criminal in a car, the police have to check with the de-facto gang leader in the car how many of them are armed and how many are not. The police have to ensure that only those who hold the guns to be shot at. The rest are actually innocents happen to be in the car for a joy ride.
5. If the police confirmed that they are chasing non-Indian criminals in a car, the police must not shoot them with their tiny pistols. They should borrow a bazookar from the army to blast off these evil and dangerous criminals in the car. Don't waste time in highway chase as it endangers road users and bystanders.